Choose one or both poems to comment on. Remember to respond to two other comments and post a TPQ.
Shall I compare you
by Markenson Momplaisir
You look like the first rose in spring
Your voice is sweeter than the birds that sing
You are the sun, and the moon when they're shining
Shall I compare you?
When my eyes fall into your eyes, I almost lose control,
You are the purest angel in the sky
You make my heart beat fast, you take my soul
Shall I compare you?
When you smile, you turn on the fun
Saying your name makes rising the sun
You calm the world with your mind, not a gun
Shall I compare you?
Shall I compare you
to the brightest star in the sky
To the most beautiful creature in the world
I can't compare you to anyone or anything
In this poor and slavery earth,
Because you are way better than everything.
Trees by Joyce Kilmer
I think that I shall never see A poem lovely as a tree. A tree whose hungry mouth is prest Against the sweet earth's flowing breast; A tree that looks at God all day, 5And lifts her leafy
arms to pray; A tree
that may in summer wear A nest of robins in
her hair; Upon
whose bosom snow has lain; Who intimately
lives with rain. 10 Poems
are made by fools like me, But only God can make a tree.
Shall I compare you talks about the first rose in spring. Normally, the first rose is a pleasant surprise, meaning that spring is finally here. A rose is extremely elegant, even if it is just one. The first rose also brings about change(the change in weather). Maybe comparing her to a rose means that she brings out change in him. Also, the author refers to her as the sun and the moon. The Sun is the basis for all life on the planet; everything needs light to survive. He is basically saying that he cannot live without her. Also, Markenson says that she calms the world with her mind. That could possibly mean that she is very patient and level headed. She is always very cool and collected.
ReplyDeleteWhy do you think that Joyce Kilmer used 'prest' in lieu of 'pressed'? Pressed is a perfectly fine rhyme for breast, so what do you think she meant to say by using her poetic license there?
The word "prest" actually has a different definition than that of "Pressed." Prest means deriving from the French to be prepared for action. Maybe she means that the tree is prepared for action such as natural disasters which has been told by the ground.
DeleteI agree that the girl he is comparing the coming of spring is like the coming of something new in his life. I also believe that the comparison between spring and the girl can also represent that the girl is bringing the narrator a fresh start. I also believe that the comparison of spring can also mean that the girl has a very "fresh" and a pleasant personality.
DeleteI actually disagree that the first rose signals the first signs of spring, because I actually believe that some roses last for a longer period of time than the season of spring or summer. This could represent the everlasting and forever love that the author has for the woman he describes about.
DeleteI believe he is comparing the first rose, almost like a first love, and the rose in spring means it is fresh and new. I disagree with the literal denotation of the seasons. Roses can also be various colors but the most common is red or white, which are both colors of peace and love.
DeleteThe rhyme scheme in Trees by Joyce Kilmer is very easy and exact. It follows the traditional: a,a;b,b;c,c;d,d;e,e;f,f. When she says that the tree is on the breast of the Earth, it could mean that the tree is forever a child of God because the usually a baby is on the breast for only a short while before the child starts to become a bit more independent. Additionally, I think that the writer wants us to have a higher respect for trees because they give nature so many things such as: Lumber and a nest for birds "in her hair". And it has been for that reason that she states that trees are only a product of God
ReplyDeleteWhy do you think that Joyce kilmer says that poems are only made by fools like me?
DeleteI believe that Kilmer said "that poems are only made by fools like me" because the poem he wrote is only praising and admiring God's creation of the tree. He believes that human are fools because they can't create anything so great like what God creates. We humans can only admire what is created by God.
DeleteRohun I agree with your statement about how the tree is on the breast of the earth. I agree with your idea of how the author wants us to have respect for trees. I think that a tree is the ultimate gift of nature because not only does it provide humans with valuable resources, but it also provides shelter for animals during the four seasons and protects them like a mother would protect her child.
Deletei think that Kilmer says that poems are made by fools like me because she is equating God to being much more. She says that only god can make the tree, but anyone can write a poem.
DeleteI think here the writer is trying to convey the beauties and simpleness of life, but even the most intricate details can only be made by God. Although Poetry is referred to by many as a work of art, with each word delicately used just perfectly, it is merely human, and nothing compares to the awesomeness of God's creations.
DeleteI think that the author said "poems are made by fools like me" because most people don't appreciate poetry. Most people don't care about it and just ignore it. They think that the authors of poems are fools, and Kilmer is trying to catch their attention to show them what poetry really is.
DeleteI believe that "Shall I Compare You" is a poem about one's first love or crush. In line 5, it says that his eyes fall into her eyes. It is said that the eyes are the windows to the soul, so when it says that he fell into her eyes, it is saying that this boy/man is in love with the beautiful and true soul of the girl. Throughout the poem, the narrator keeps on questioning on whether or not to compare to the fine things of earth. However, in the end of the poem, he finally decides to not compare her to the wonders of life, however he realizes that this girl is far better than what he mentioned. Also, the things that the narrator compares the girl to can also show the traits of the one he loves. In stanza 1 he says that she is very natural with a "voice [that] is sweeter than the birds that sing [she is] the sun, and the moon when they're shining". In the second stanza, he compares her to an angel showing that he sees her as holy and perfect. Finally in the 3rd stanza, he says that she is very happy and joyful. In the last stanza, he finally made a decision to adore the girl.
ReplyDelete[co="purple"] Thought provoking question [/co]
Why do you think that Momplaisir used the sun and the moon to compare the girl when the moon is just the reflection of the sun's light?
I like that your TPQ is a different question. Bravo. I'll grab a few key elements from tonight's blog spot to share with the class. I may give a few "bacon" points for tonight's responses. LB
DeleteMaybe he is saying that she has two personalities. She can be happy or sad calm or emotional. But there is always that core element of her within. When shes around him there is always that sun
DeleteI think that Momplaisir used the sun and the moon to compare the girl because without the sun, the moon would not be visible. As a result, the moon needs the sun and the sun needs the moon. If these two essential objects were not in the universe, it would not exist. I think what the poet means is that the special someone is perfect for them, like yin and yang.
DeleteI think the author used the moon and the sun to compare him and the girl, to show that they are meant for each other just as the sun and the moon work with each other and create life on earth or in this case "love".
DeleteThe poem "Trees" by Joyce Kilmer, provides the reader with much vivid imagery and personification with the obvious presentation of "Mother Earth". However, the concept that the trees and grass and flowers are all children of Mother Earth has never really been made. In this poem, the living, moving, green children are rooted deep into the "breast" of the earth. This is really a symbol for the heart; under the breast (of both males and females) is the heart. Also, line 2: "[a]gainst the sweet earth's flowing breast") implies that the earth is plentiful and gives much to her children.
ReplyDeleteAnother fact I would like to point out is that flowers, trees, and all other plants grow in the direction of the sun. If the light moves, so the living, breathing children of earth follow. However, the poem states that "[a] tree... looks at God all day" (line 5). Perhaps this is the reason Native Americans, Mayans, and other groups believed, or still believe, that the sun is the god.
Trees also live and grow every second of a day; they experience the changes and survive the seasons. They could also be seen as a child of the sun, god, the "Creator". Always watched over, always nurtured. This poem could, in turn, be a representation of family: the sun, the earth, and the trees.
TPQ: Would you consider the sun and earth to be the parents of life? If not, then who?
I would consider the Sun and the Earth to be the parents of life because to take it into context is that early life forms were created on the Earth which was because of the Sun. Additionally, if it were not for the atmosphere of the Earth and the Sun itself, then there would not be any life that could actually support itself.
DeleteI think the Sun is both the mother and father of life. Without sun, life wouldn't exist. And yes, we can only survive on earth, but there are probably more creatures out in other galaxies that need the sun for survival as well. With the sun, we strive through live. Therefore, the sun represents the mother and father of life.
DeleteI think that the sun and the moon can be considered the parents of life, since they represent opposites and therefore can symbolize the diversity of life today. Other than the obvious things the sun and the moon do for us, they also have served as a source of inspiration and comfort since the beginning of time, and in that sense, they are the basis from which all life comes forth.
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ReplyDeleteI want to comment on the poem "Shall I compare you". I think that this poem is about love at first sight and how everyone gets butterflies in their stomachs when they see that special someone they like. In the first line when it explains "You are the first rose in the spring", I think it represents that the person is unique, since the color of a rose in the spring stands out. In the third stanza where it mentions heart beating fast, I think that it represents a heart attack and how your soul gets taken to the heavens after passing away. I believe this poem is trying to explain how even though this planet is sometimes filled with pain and misery, that special someone is always there to brighten the day and relieve that stress.
ReplyDeleteTPQ: What does it mean when Momplaisir states, "Saying your name makes rising the sun"?
ReplyDeleteI believe it means that hearing your name makes my day. It makes the sun rise. It takes me out of the encompasing darkness known as night
DeleteI think that that phrase means that only you make the sun rise and your name controls the days. A name is the "wrapping on the present" if you will, and he is saying that wrapping on the present wills the sun up for another day.
DeleteI think since the sunrise is a beautiful way to start out the day spreading color and light throughout the world, and saying your name or thinking about you spreads light and color throughout my world
DeleteI think he is basically trying to saying the name brighten ups his day and he doesn't feel down but happy to look foward the rest of the day
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DeleteI think he means that when he says his true love's name, it fills him up with light and warmth like how the sun does.
DeleteI agree with the above speakers, but i would also like to stress the point that the phrase is makes rise the sun not the sun is rising, because the sun is to us the largest and most important body in the universe, and it is only by some great force that it could rise or fall, and i think that he is saying that saying the name of this person gives him the power to make rise the sun, and his love for her is more powerful than anything that exists, though some could say it is a hyperbole, there could also be the argument that love is strong enough of an emotion to bring forth these kinds of feats, so I ask you as my TPQ, is it an exaggeration of love, or is it a true and accurate account of the strength of the emotion?
DeleteThe day can't start without the sun rising, so I believe that he says that every day can't start if she wasn't there because she is everything to him.
DeleteSaying your name makes rising the sun means that everything in the world is dark until she comes. Without the sun, there would be no life on this planet. This means that she makes everything on the Earth come alive and live.
DeleteMy favorite poem of the two is trees. Mostly because it is so rich with information. The tree is A life dedicated to god and created by god. It might symbolize a true dedication to a god maybe like monks who spend their days in prayer. I also see it as a statement that humans are imperfect beings that what we make cannot be compared to gods level. This is shown in the saying that poetry is made by fools (humans). But a tree can only be created by a god.
ReplyDeleteTpq
DeleteWhat do they mean that the tree is against earths flowing breast
Maybe it means that the tree is going to stand for what it believes in not in what the rest of the world believes in. Especially since now-a-days, people do a lot of things just because other are doing it.. like peer pressure and drugs. So while the rest of the world is destroying itself pretending to be something its not, the tree will stay real and true to itself.
DeleteI think it is metaphorically saying that the trees are children but they are feeding off the breast of mother earth
DeleteI think they are saying that the trees are the strong holding life forms on Earth that have dug their roots into many years of history. They are the nuturers of all life on earth, just as mothers are, as they provide many living creatures with shelter and food.
DeleteI think the poem "Shall I Compare You?" is about falling in love and how love feels. Additionally, I think this poem talks about time and history, and there effects on each other. When the author, Markenson Momplaisir, says "shall I compare you? it is contradicts itself as you read further into the poem. I think this because the author asks if he/she shall be compared too, but the author does anyway. For example if you take a look at the first line, the author already compares his or her love to the sweetness of singing birds.
ReplyDeleteThe first stanza also gives me a feeling of springtime and a sense of time. The author uses singing birds, and roses to create a scene for us and uses alot of imagery. As seasons change through time, I also can see references to war in this poem. I think that when the author says "You calm the world with your mind, not a gun" they talk about war. Another reference is when the author states that his/her soul is taken away by this mysterious lover, he or she is talking about death.
Speaking of war and history, the author also mentions something about slavery. Markenson Momplaisir tells us that love is the light in the darkness. Not only the darkness of war, but slavery and also the fear of time changing and coming too fast.
Using poetic devices: the author uses repetition of "shall I compare you?" and it feels like most of this poem is made up of metaphors..
Question: Why do you think that Markenson Momplaisir put things as dark as slavery into a love poem?
-A
I think that Markenson puts things as dark as slavery into a love poem because he probably wants to add "intensity" or more emotional effect into the poem by using his life experiences or the world around him.
DeleteThe poem "Shall i compare you" talks about a the first rose in springtime. this can mean that the first time since the other seasons that something has bloomed or shown up. This could mean that it was the first time he has seen such a beautiful thing to him in a long while. Then comes the duality of the sun and moon claiming that they are both amazing but "She" is much more. When he falls into her eyes in line 5, They say love is blind and it can make you do irrational things. He continues to talk about his heart beating fast, a usual thing that occurs when you get excited, but also says that she takes his soul meaning that she has him all tied up with her beauty that overwhelms his thoughts and emotions. This poem is mainly talking about love and even through all the slavery and violence(gun) in this world "She" makes him smile.
ReplyDeleteThe poem trees contains the repitition of A's and the assonance of the vowel. i think it tries to repeat it to emphasize the singularity of A tree 1 tree A poem 1 poem. I believe that this poem could also be about love in the sense that tree rhymes and sounds very similar to THEE. this gives the tone that the author is talking about one he or she admires that can withstand all the seasons and still only God can create such a beautiful thing.
My thought provoking question is: How come the rhyme pattern changes in shall i compare you in the last stanza as it talks about the earth?
ReplyDeleteI think the rhyme pattern changes to show that everything around us is always changing. It is also to emphasize the words at the end of the lines. The words that stood out to me are: everything and anything. These words symbolize things never ending and eternity.
DeleteAdding on to Katy's statement, it's also the turning point where he says he can't compare her. Like a fulcrum, I guess. There's sky-world/earth, beautiful-poor, anything-everything, can compare her-can't compare her. Last of all, I'd like to point at that he goes from kind of formal "shall" to informal, close, personal "you are way better".
DeleteIn the poem "Shall I Compare You?" it puzzles me how the author includes devastating things like slavery and guns into a love poem. I think that maybe he is including those things is because he wants to reveal his love for this woman by using his past experiences or the world around him. I think that the poem is probably about first loves, because usually people overreact and over-exaggerate their feelings for this girl because it is the first time they are experiencing it.
ReplyDeleteTPQ: "Saying your name makes rising the sun"? What does this mean?
I definitely agree with JJ about his emphasis on love and emotion is most probably just anxiety and nerves for his first crush/love. His reverences to violence may be attributed to a painful past and/or a foreboding future.
DeleteThe poem "Shall I Compare You" is about someone who is in love with another person, and he or she compares their lover to the many beautiful things of the earth. The irony of this poem is that the title is Shall I Compare You?, and in the beginning, the author compares their lover to the sun and moon, the two big forces of the earth, showing duality. In the end, the author says that their lover is incomparable to anything of the earth. Also, another duality in this poem is in the end, where the author is referring to the most beautiful things of the earth, saying the lover is incomparable to them, and then the author refers to the earth as a "poor and slavery earth." To this, I think the author did this to show that there are two sides to this world, a good side and a bad side.
ReplyDeleteMy thought provoking question is when she says you calm the world with your mind, not a gun, what does she mean? How does a gun calm the world, when it usually causes outrage and violence?
I believe that the word "gun" is used because it is seen as a weapon. A weapon can scare others and can surprise an opponent. Thus, it might silence the opponent because one might be very shocked.
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DeleteA gun does not calm the world in its denotation but it can harm and force people into obeying orders which makes it easier for the person with the gun to get through. It does cause outrage and violence but to stop that violence we sometimes also resort to violence.
Delete"political power rolls out the barrel of a gun." -Mao Zedong, a gun is a very violent and aggressive way of maintaining order, by subjugation, wheras the mind is a much more serene way of keeping that same order, by using reason and knowledge. I believe that he is trying to not only say that she is an intelligent person, but also a powerful one who can calm the world, but also a serene one who will use her brain not brawn to accomplish this. He is also drawing a parallel to how love is a calming but also aggressive emotion, many wars have been cause by love, but so have great works of peace and beauty, and i think that the author is also saying that his love is a pure calming kind and not one of subjugation or violence
DeleteStarting with the title of "Shall I Compare You?", I read it as sarcasm almost because the poem goes on to compare so many beautiful things in life and at the end it says 'Shall I compare you?" as if saying "really?...".
ReplyDeleteThe first line says 'you look like the first rose in spring'. This could mean that you're the first beautiful thing I see (rose) in the midst of this beautiful day (spring).Also since many people look forward to spring to bring back happiness taken away from harsh winters, you being the first rose in spring, could mean you're the sign of my happiness arriving.
For the next line, I'd lake to make a connection to TKAM because the line says "you're voice is sweeter than the birds that sing" and in TKAM, Mrs. Maudie says mockingbirds don't do anything but bring people happiness and joy so maybe it's saying your voice brings joy to my life.
You are the sun and the moon when they're shining. The sun and the moon represent night and day and when they're shining, they bring light to the world. So maybe it's saying "you light up my world like nobody else" (-1D) all the time, whether it's night or day.
When my eyes fall into your eyes, I almost lose control. Eyes are the window to the sou and when our souls connect its so powerful for me alone to control myself.
You are the purest angel in the sky. Angels represent good, purity, and kindness, and the sky is on top of us and it somewhat controls our life because of the weather- whether we get sick or not, what we'll wear that day, whether we carry an umbrella or not is mostly determined by the sky which shows how powerful it is and you being the purest angel in the sky means you affect my life so greatly with a good impact.
You make my heart beat fast, you take my soul. Our heart beating is what keeps us alive. Usually when anxiety overcomes us, our heart beats fast so when I'm around you I get nervous because you have full control of my soul.
When you smile, you turn on the fun. When you're happy, your feeling spreads everywhere making everyone else happy.
Saying your name makes rising the sun. When you say a person's name, you automatically get a picture of that person in your head. The sunrise is beautiful casting it's light and color over the world and starting a new day everyday. So every time I think of you, I think of color and light and happiness spreading throughout my world.
You calm the world with your mind, not a gun. In history, guns and war were always used for peace. WW1 was thought to be the War To End All Wars because it was to restore peace to the world but the result was losing an entire generation of people for 20 short years of peace. But you use your mind to calm everyone because you're smart and know how to avoid unnecessary fighting.
Shall I compare you to the brightest star in the sky- the bluest and purest and hottest and most powerful star in our sky. to the most beautiful creature in the world- I think of a graceful, perfect non-existant creature; non-existant because the author says a creature not a living organism.
I can't compare you to anyone or anything because it probably won't do you any justice
In this poor and slavery earth that's deprived of all the rich happiness and purity you have to offer, and even though there are beautiful and happy things in this poor world, you're better than all of them- you bring the true happiness and beauty to my world. And this is the reason that fills in the ellipses at the top. The author is saying shall I compare you as in "really? because you ring the true happiness and beauty to my world."
The author uses many poetic devices such as repetition, similes, metaphors, definitely imagery, and alliteration in lines 1-3, 6-7.
Question: Besides making it a love poem, was Markenson Momplaisir trying to convey another message?
I think Markenson Momplaisir is also trying to show that the Earth has many evils. Each individual has their own idea about the world. Although there are a lot of bad things in the world, there are also things to be happy about.
DeleteI think Markenson Momplaisir is trying to convey to the reader the idea that with love comes sacrifices that may not always be the easiest decisions to make. This may be the small bit of evil embedded into every loving relationship. I think this is shown in the last stanza of the poem.
DeleteYes. I think he also wanted to show readers a reality of the world..Love does exist but so does war, and back in the day:slavery. He adds that into his love poem because he may believe that love will always prosper and be justified whereas war, or slavery..will not.
Deleteanother message that the author could be trying to convey is that the earth and nature are so beautiful and to appreciate it and how much we need it but to also acknowledge the fact that the world we have created is " poor and slavery" and contradicts natures value and purpose.
DeleteI think the author is also trying to convey that the most beautiful things in life aren't beautiful anymore because of the hatred and evil within this world or the "poor and slavery" as the author put it.
DeleteIn shall i compare you by Markenson Momplaisir i think the author is talking about his first child and how much he loves he/she. Markenson says "you look like the first rose in spring" spring is the season of new life because its when flowers bloom representing life and usually relates to the begining of life like a new child. Also he says "you calm the world with your mind not a gun" represents a childs innocence and peace it brings to the world like how scout in tkam stopped the mob when Atticus was sitting outside the cell of Tom Robinson. Basicallly throughout the poem he is talking about how much he loves his child and describes the child's purity and innocence question: why does Markenson bring slavery into the poem towards the end?
ReplyDeleteI believe that makenson brings slavery in to describe the violence and cruelty in this world to show that even through all the wrong things in life something good can come out.
DeleteI believe that Markenson brings slavery into the poem because it steers clear of cliche, sappy, stereotypical love poem. The mention of slavery almost dirties the poem, brings us back to reality, and unveils the dirty truth.
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DeleteI like that you changed the perspective from lovers to parenting, and indeed you have points that support a solid argument for your case, either one could be valid, or it could be both, a poem about the universal power of love, the idea of "One Love, One Heart." I would also like to point out the irony of debate, which can be construed as conflict over a poem about love
DeleteThe poem "Shall I Compare You" definitely talks about two lovers and how one of them compares the world away for the other but in the end notices no satisfaction with anything found on our Earth. This nevertheless still relates to shortness of some relationships and how exactly they were destined to fall apart. Once the first date passes and things stop going uphill, both sides know each other to pretty much the core. Usually, when they do this, they notice the other just isn't what they are cracked up to be and what they've been dreaming and fantasizing of. Some relationships are strong enough to withstand this space and comfortability, but unfortunately and quite realisticly not most.
ReplyDeleteThe fact that one of the lovers ran out of things to say may represent a realization of "words themselves cannot describe you". However, this may also represent a truth revealed later on in the poem. The truth that changes the relationship forever. Perhaps he didn't want to continue because he was being made to do so to keep the relationship going. Maybe it was because gossip and the very curious element of jealousy was enough to break his train of thought.
But wait there's more!
Despite the thoroughly pessimistic point of view and conclusion above, there is a way that the relationship actually worked and at that perfectly. The various dualities (sun and the moon; mind and gun) may even represent the various things the relationship has survived. The end of the poem may even suggests an apparent end to all conflicts due the realization that with the experiences they have, they can face any obstacle that stands in the way of their relationship's progress if they stick together. I will go as far as to say that maybe (just maybe) the couple has grown mature enough to accept marriage therefore presenting the end of the conflicts caused by a so-called "unofficial relationship".
My thought provoking question is: Why did the author going against proper English grammar rules say 'poor and slavery earth' instead of 'poor and enslaved earth'?
TPQ answer: Many poets go against grammar to emphasize something or symbolize another. "poor and slavery earth" may be an allusion to the troubles humankind has created, but all is better in the view of love. It may also be used to be a contrast to "Because you are way better than everything." The combination of both is more powerful than by themselves, it is powerful.
DeleteA brief note, did u purposefully say going against english grammar when it should be go against grammar? I just found that rather fitting, and on the point of your question, the statement gives the connotation that the definition of Earth is poor and slavery, which some see it as, whereas others see it as a great planet full of beauty and accomplishment, but either way it is a fact that we have wrought evils upon it. However,in almost every classic tale of good vs. evil, it is also love vs. lust, a pure innocent love against what some would call unholy coveting and jealousy. I think that Henry VIII (above) is right that it is a contrast, a contrast between the greatest crimes ever, poverty and slavery, to the greatest force of good ever, love.
DeleteThe poem that I connected with immediately upon reading was “Trees” by Joyce Kilmer. In order to develop a better understanding of the poem, I quickly researched his background. Joyce Kilmer was a writer, soldier, and devout Catholic gentleman. Many religious elements can be found in this literary work. For example, reference stanza 3: “A tree that looks at God all day, and lifts her leafy arms to pray.” After analyzing the poem, I believe that the trees and poems are the women and the daughters of the world. In the last stanza, Kilmer states, “Poems are made by fools like me, but only God can make a tree.” Poems are strong, thought provoking, beautiful, and intense, as are ALL women regardless of their social class, race, education level, wealth, etc. Trees are deep rooted to the earth, wise, old, and a nurturing home to many different creatures. The point that I believe Kilmer is striving to make is that the men of the world are giving birth to women that aren’t being used and developed to their full potential. In order to do so, it is important to hold a relationship with God and only he can help you to grow as strong and wise as a tree. This poem is really stressing the importance of religion in the lives of humanity.
ReplyDeleteTPQ: What women in today’s society are considered poems and trees?
I understand "Shall I Compare You" by Markenson Momplaisir as his first crush/love/lust (Lust being somewhat controversial).The three stages of love are the same for everyone: lust or physical attraction, romantic feelings, and emotional attachment. The stages of love aren't necessarily separated by markers like anniversaries or events (such as getting married). Rather, the three stages of love blend together in one long stroke of love. In the poem, he makes many comments about her beauty and form (physical things), therefore,he may be experiencing lust, or physical attraction. His comparisons and ideas are very romantic, therefore he shows another side of his love; he is making an effort. The objects and beings he compares her to are special to many people, nurturing and intimate things, and so he depicts his emotional intimacy towards the girl. Markenson is expressing love at its fullest towards this girl, lets hope she knows he exists.
ReplyDeleteThe poem reminded me of a song from Adele "First Love", a stanza in particular:
So little to say but so much time,
Despite my empty mouth the words are in my mind.
Please wear the face, the one where you smile,
Because you lighten up my heart when I start to cry.
Thought provoking Question for you: How have poems, love poems especially, affected people in their daily lives? (As an encouraging influence, stray thoughts, increasing passion, or nonchalant ignorance)
The song First Love by Adele reminded me of the first poem also!
DeleteThe musical piece has an almost dark, saddening yet excited vibe, that is so similar to "Shall I compare you".
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NZjydUWD7f4
Please listen!
Love poems effect me in an indescribable way, any teenager really. We are all growing up so quickly and we are beginning crave something more than just a friendship with our friends of the opposite sex. The insane thoughts that swirl and dance within our minds are simply indescribable. Love poems are a source of nutrition for these thoughts. It strengthens the level of insanity and almost reasons between what the brain wants and the heart demands. I'm a hopeless romantic so my perspective is pretty cheesy.
Not cheesy at all. you just described me in a nutshell. Both reading and writing them gives me this no-word-can-describe-it feeling. Feels good, real good. Maybe this is why poetry has been a prevalent part of all human civilizations, especially today.
DeleteI love this song! And I agree, it's a great fit to the first poem. It supports the idea of a "First Love". Of falling in love for the first time and just wanting to hold onto it. It's putting on a form of a mask to hide the fact that this may very well be your first time falling in love and maybe your scared of being lost of maybe things just didn't turn out the way you hoped they would. Both, the song and the poem, share connected feelings that I beleieve at least once in every person's life will, have, or is experiencing.
Delete@Nic: glad to see you in the fight...LB
DeleteI think the poem "Shall I Compare You" is about the fear of losing a treasured love in a world filled with natural beauty. I think that the main character has fallen in love with anohter character that is also maybe out of his/her league. The author is in some ways questioning himself as to whether or not he should even let his eyes wonder onto other natural beauties.
ReplyDeleteI also think this poem explains new love being born into a world of natural beauty. The first stanza gives the readed an essence of springtime, which in literature is often referred to as a time of rebirth and renewal. Through description, imagery is created in the mind of the reader.
There is also some irony presented within this poem. With the many references to the sun, moon, and stars, the reader gets a sense of certainty. The daily cycle that the sun, moon, and stars go through is a process the will definetly occur. However, the author questions if he should compare his love to many other beauties. almost as if he is very uncertain of his love.
My question is: Why is the author so afraid of comparing his love to the natural beauties of the world? And why does the author tie in words such as "slavery" and "poor" into a poem based upon love?
I think the author uses words of suffering and poverty to set a bar for what he has to offer, maybe he is saying that he will never let those things happen to her. I dont agree that he is afraid or hesitant to compare her to things as beautiful as those, he is ready and willing to gain her love through so-called incomparable wonders.
DeleteI think the poem by Markenson Momplaisir is trying to convey several messages. One of these messages is that the world is always changing. People are changing, societies are changing, and even the Earth is changing. It's hard to hold onto life and try to keep up with the world. Instead of keeping up with the world's changes, we should just live life to the fullest and enjoy the small things in life. Markenson Momplaisir is trying to tell us to be optimistic and enjoy life. The author makes references to the happy things in life: roses, spring, birds, the sun, the moon, angels, smiles, and the sky.
ReplyDeleteThought Provoking Question: In the poem Trees, why does the author refer to a woman as a tree?
As a tree bears life and nurtures life (through fruit), so does a woman. The mothers of society have a sort of intuition of their child, this also happens with trees, they can feel when a storm is coming or cold and prepare themselves for it. Trees also grow in the shape of a V, women have been symbolized in art and literature as the V, for the shape of a womb.
DeleteThroughout the poem, the author personifies the tree as a female, motherly, nurturing sort of figure. For example, the way that the tree relies on the earth for food is reminiscent of the way a newborn child relies on its mother for milk. As the tree grows, it then becomes able to provide for animals of its own, which can be seen as a “nest of robins in her hair.” This is much like the way a mother, as she grows, takes the responsibility of helping provide for her family.
DeleteKaty, in turn, let me ask you a question. Is it better to enjoy a quick, fake, shallow love (kind of like Mildred) or to invest and sacrifice for a greater, but more painful love?
DeleteAnd as an answer to to your question, I think it is because a tree is so multi-potent. It nurtures, grows, holds the ground, gives fruit, and is beautiful. Just like women.
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ReplyDeleteBefore i begin to analyze the poem, i would like to bring to discussion the specific use of the word shall, for we are using it in the context of is it possible, whereas i think he is more saying that can he compare her, asking permission, and when he takes it, he heaps on the praise in no small quantity. For thousands of years, the stars have been the instrument used to find direction, to find purpose and to find guidance, either in actual navigation, or in the prospect of the heavens being religious guidance. Either way, we see that he is looking to her as a person to guide him, as most good partners do for the other, and that he is expressing that his love is greater than all, his partnership the strongest by the sheer magnitude of his comparisons. Many other religious references are seen in the mention of angels and heavenly bodies, the latter being the deities of many old faiths, which could possibly be a parallel to the idea that his love can transcend time. As a final point, i believe the idea of a beat to be of great importance, for all poetry has a beat, and a beat is a rhythm, it is musical, it is art, just like his love is musical. Also a rhythm is a pattern, and a pattern is a cycle, and though this is a poem about his specific love, it is also about the endless cycle of love in general, the beat of its drum, as Shakespeare said "if music be the food of love, play on." This is especially apparent when you look at the fact that he states make my HEART beat fast, as the heart is the place we believe love resides. Interesting ironies in this stanza include a failing in the beat due to the repetition of the word eyes, and the fact that the soul is mentioned right after heart and beat, the heart being again known as the core of our persona, soul and love, and to take my soul has been seen as death, the beat of death, and the cycle of death, but i would day it is more akin to the phrase, "i give you my heart," than the negative connotations we have given it thusfar, all in all a much more benign story. As afore mentioned, I believe that though he is talking about his lover, the argument about parenting is also valid, and I would like to take the stance that he is making a universal poem aout love
ReplyDeleteIt is very interesting that you point out the word shall and it's many uses, because that can just bring much more meaning to this poem. The stars giving direction is actually something that i may have never thought of and i think it is a brilliant point. And you do say something profound by mentioning the failing beat of the poem which i find interesting
Delete"Shall I compare you", I think is obviously about love and it has a respectful tone because it uses the word "shall" and it is also complimentary since there are many positive comparisons made. The author also uses a lot of imagery and uses words like "voice", "eyes" and "sweeter" to show the five sense and express the power of love. Roses are symbolic because they represent love and the beauty of nature. I also think Markenson Momplaisir is trying to demonstrate that love is eternal and that when you are in love you feel immortal by the words "you take my soul". Markenson Momplaisir also makes comparisons to "the sun and the moon", "the brightest star", and "earth" to show that love is infinite and to reference outer space and how love is like gravity. This poem could also be a reference to Shakespeare.
ReplyDeleteTPQ:Why does the author contradict his question and his comparisons by saying "I can't compare you to anyone or anything"?
It is definitely about love! He loves her so much, and he is respectful to her. He doesn't say anything crude about beauty and compliments her to the beauty of nature.
DeleteI think he "contradicts" himself because he wants to say he is speechless. Her beauty, her presence, her everything is so stunning and that it makes his mind go blank with nothing but love. It's like when someone says "you're eyes are as blue as the oceans" or something of the sort. But in this poem, he's saying "you're eyes are even more beautiful than the blue of the oceans". He can't describe her because she is purely beautiful. It's like trying to describe a new color.
DeleteIt can't be much better stated than above that his feelings for this person and her traits that warrant them transcend all boundaries and all obstacles that would try to hold it in place, but i dont believe he is speechless, for if he was, how is it that he is speaking via his poetry?
DeleteSo yes i posted this as a reply to an above post, but to open up a separate thread for my TPQ: i would also like to stress the point that the phrase is makes rise the sun not the sun is rising, because the sun is to us the largest and most important body in the universe, to many ancient peoples it was a god and we still call it a heavenly body and it is only by some great force that it could rise or fall, if by nay force at all. I think that he is saying that saying the name of this person, thinking of her, gives him the power to make rise the sun, and his love for her is more powerful than anything that exists. Though some could say it is a hyperbole, there could also be the argument that love is strong enough of an emotion to bring forth these kinds of feats, so I ask you as my TPQ, is it an exaggeration of love to say that it can make rise the sun, or is it a true and accurate account of the strength of the emotion?
ReplyDeleteIt is a hyperbole, but yes, it does demonstrate the extremely powerful nature of love. What makes men go to extreme measures, bouts of alcoholism and depression, and even cut off an ear? It is only love. Yet in this poem, the speaker does not have a true love and thus does not have the same power.
DeleteTrees is a very short poem, enabling the use of couplets in a about 6 stanzas to create a work of art.She states in the final line that "poetry is made by fools like me, but only God can make a tree." Her poetry is already intricately created, but against the vast creations of God's power and will a mere being like her will never compare. She adopts a sense of devout and a humble attitude, and praises the wonderful gifts of trees, and although they may look simple, they are actually wonderfully created organisms.
ReplyDeleteTPQ: What is the effectiveness of rhyme? Does rhyme make you more attracted to read or poem, or would you read free verse(Shakespeare)?
I think when poems rhyme is does attract the reader to continue to read. Having rhythm in the poem makes it more musical for the audience to read. I think the effectiveness of rhyming is that is gives the poem a strong beat behind it and brings it together like a bass guitar in a band.
DeleteJust like Kimberly said, the rhyme does make it want people to keep reading the poem. For free verse, I think you would have to use your voice to show the different sounds in the poem to show the accented or unaccented letters in the poem, rather then just to read it with your eyes.
DeleteThis poem is absolutely touching. A man is passionately in love with his girl and he cannot compare her to even the most beautiful natural things in nature because she is even more beautiful and gorgeous than that. His girl has a strong personality, and is almost perfect! She's beautiful and she has the ability to do many things. TPQ: Why does he compare things only in nature to her?
ReplyDeleteI think comparing her to nature shows that his love for her is very natural and pure. The world consists of nature and Momplaisir is saying that she is the world to him.
Delete'Shall I Compare You' by Markenson Momplaisir is about a slave loving a white man. "You calm the world with your mind, not a gun" the white man is peace-loving, and tries to solve conflicts with less violent ways, without guns or violence. "You are the purest angel in the sky", "the most beautiful creature in the world" and "the brightest star in the sky" shows that the the slave really, truly loved and cherished the white man. "When my eyes fall into your eyes, I almost lose control" says that when the slave was in the presence of the man, she totally became a different person, loses control of her old self, to be able to live in the moment. She becomes 'absobed' into his eyes, as if nothing else exists in the world, except for him. "Saying your name makes rising the sun" means that saying his name, talking to him, seeing him, gives her the power to endure life. Despite life being so rough for her "in this poor and slavery earth", he gives her the power to keep moving on.
ReplyDeleteMarkenson Momplaisir uses symbolism and imagery in “Shall I Compare You” to show his unconditional love to a girl. I believe the author describes the girl to be the sun, because the sun is essential for all of life. After all, the sun allows photosynthesis to happen, and without photosynthesis, human life would not be able to be sustained here on earth. Therefore, this shows that she is an essential and huge part of the author’s life. Not only that, but the author also describes the girl to the moon. The moon is also very important because it controls the tides, and waves are very powerful. I believe this symbolizes the girl’s power over the author. Moreover, the author also compares this girl to the brightest star in the sky. The brightest star is usually used to make a wish. Therefore, I believe that the author is trying to say the girl is better that a wish come true. Overall, the author is trying to say that this girl is very important to him?
ReplyDeleteTPQ: Why does the author call the world poor and slavery when he already admits that this girl is amazing?
I'd like to add layers to your foundation if you don't mind Allison. The science references are definitely profound, but the one i would like to focus on the most is the moon and the tides. Tides are waves and waves are a powerful force, so powerful it can shatter and erode rock and stone, and sink ships and take millions of lives and if you control that kind of a force, how powerful are you? Also, water washes away impurity, and he believes that she can wash away the impurity in him, and waves and tide cause great changes by afore mentioned erosion and such, reflecting the changes she can manifest in him. A final point on the moon,it revolves around the earth doggedly, pulled in by the force of its gravity, as he is by the force of human gravity, which is love, to her.
DeleteIn the poem "Shall I Compare You" the author is talking about you're true love. Momplaisir compares his true love to a rose, birds, the sun, the moon. He is comparing her to the world and saying that she is the world to him. But yet at the end of the poem he says that she is "way better than everything" meaning that there is no point of comparing her when she is already better than everything in the world. We can see the moon because it reflects light from the sun. "When my eyes fall into your eyes, I almost lose control" The eyes are the windows to the soul. Later on in the poem he says "you take me soul" meaning that he is living his life for her. "You make my heart beat fast" saying that whenever he sees her, he gets butterflies and gets nervous. "You calm the world with your mind, not a gun" Some people help "calm" the world by killing their opponent like in wars, but she calms it with her mind
ReplyDeleteTPQ: Why does Momplaisir say that his eyes "fall into" her eyes instead of just when their eyes meeting?
I believe that Momplaisir says "fall into" her eyes to stress the point that the boy is falling deeply in love with the soul of the girl. The boy doesn't like the girl just for her looks, but he likes her for who she is on the inside and what she truly is.
DeleteUsually when your eyes meet with someone, its usually the first time you are meeting with them. You don't really know anything about this person yet. However, when you use the word 'fall into' it shows how he would give his life to her and see her for who she really is like what Athena said.
DeleteIn the poem “Trees” by Joyce Kilmer, the narrator relates the various characteristics of a tree to human traits and actions; in other words, uses personification to describe trees. The author describes the way trees feed off of the earth for survival, in a dependent, almost childlike way. Trees also raise their branches to the sky, an act of reverence towards God above, and therefore they can be seen as holy or pure. The fact that a tree would also carry a nest of robins shows their nurturing, life-sustaining ability, and the way they interact with the rain and the snow show their growth and maturity. The author then goes on to say that anything man can make, in this case a poem, cannot compare with the natural beauty that is a tree. Thought provoking question: Why does the author continually compare poems and trees?
ReplyDeleteThank you Raji for pointing out the personification in this poem, it is actually very interesting that you are giving a tree these human-like traits and then comparing it to the poem once more. I actually think the author is comparing the poem to a tree because that may be her best "weapon" in trying to convey to someone the beauty of a tree, but no matter how good that weapon is to her, it an never show the natural beauty
Delete"Love is the most powerful force in the world." In this declaration of love, it is tempting to say that the man is in a dedicated, innocent, and pure type of love for the girl of his dreams. He sees her as the "purest angel/ brightest star in the sky" and as "better than everything," yet there lay a different, darker side to the "agape" love that he "possesses. A side that reveals his immaturity and
ReplyDeleteUpon scrutiny of the diction, it can clearly be seen that he is simply overwhelmed by the outside appearances of her. The shallow, ephemeral looks of his love. Despite what he may believe, his love is not true: he is only captivated by her sheer external beauty, not her internal beauty, and from her appearance, he is convinced that he has fallen in love with a woman. Yes, it is cynical, but in each stanza, his emotions are solely caused by "her eyes," her "smile," her "voice" and her "name." Not once does he mention her personality or the cherished times that they had shared, demonstrating that his concept of love is skewed and myopic.
Also evidently displayed, the lover childishly shows no concern of his future with his woman. He seems solely concerned with his enjoyment of having a beautiful girl around him, not a compassionate companion. Because of his deep propensity for looks and short-lived pleasures, he avers that he "can't compare [her] to anyone or anything." This seemingly altruistic statement actually shows the shallow nature of his thought processes, and more importantly, the lacking nature of his love. By not comparing her to anything negative or realistic, he chooses to blind himself from reality. He chooses to be ignorant from the truth and use the name of love to overlook the blatant flaws that his "perfect girl" possesses. Thus, a futile future is inevitable, as it is quite observable that he will only try to quell forthcoming problems that will arise because of the unhealthy nature and reason of his mania.
The callow obsession that this man displays clearly demonstrates only serves to please his eye, and not his actual soul. He is young, and foolish, and cannot realize that his love, is truly not love at all, but rather a mere, temporary preoccupation.
My thought provoking question is: How does the media/society's view on love alter the normal perception of love?
"Shall I Compare You?" to me is a love poem. I think the poet is trying to express how much he loved this girl. It's not really a first love or date, but its been a while since he did have a first date with this girl. During the poem, he asks the same question "Shall I Compare You?" and in the last stanza he writes, that he can't compare her with anything in this world. I think this means that after describing her, he just couldn't find anything. In the last stanza, it says the "brightest star", and then states how this world is poor and has slavery, I think he was trying to make a comparison of how the slaves used the "brightest star" or the north star.
ReplyDeleteIn the poem "Trees", the poet brings the tree to life. She uses personification to make this tree have body parts like us. In the lines 4 and 5 it shows how trees are not slouched or their branches do not grow down, but it keeps growing toward the sky. I think she used her religion or God with trees because he had created everything in this world, and in the first book of the bible, Genesis, he has a garden filled with different kind of trees, and this places was like his testing of faith. So, like the last stanza, she is trying to point out that he is the creator, and we are not like God, and that he is much greater than us.
QUESTION: Why do you think he thought that guns were a way of calming the Earth?
The poem Trees to me is blatantly talking about the incomparable beauty of nature, while ironically saying that a poem can never be as great and breath taking as the real thing. I think that she is blatantly trying to convey that a poem, no matter how great it is or how many fluffy words are in there, is still just a poem. You can write about a tree for hours on end creating the best imagery there is, creating an extremely vivid picture in someone's mind, but it still only amounts to imagining the tree. Though ironically Kilmer is using a vivd imagery to convey her message to us. Trying write down all the wonders of the trees she sees, so that we can imagine them, but puts the poem's importance compared to the tree lower, to tell us to go out and see the tree for ourselves and surely we'll be in awe. That last part where she says "poems are only made by fools like me, But only God can make a tree" she's trying to say that people like us with no omniscient view and power over the universe can only write to explain the beauty of things like a tree in nature, but only those with the omniscient power can literally show someone what that tree is.
ReplyDeleteMy TPQ: You see this idea of comparing in the first poem by Momplaisir, but then you see the idea of incomparison in the second poem by Kilmer where you can't compare a poem to the real thing. Is there some sort of connection you can make between these two poems?
Shall I compare you is about a man who is completely obsessed with a woman. She is everything to him, and without her, his world would be a dark and lonely place. He says that she is the sun and moon when they're shining. By itself, the sun is extremely bright, you cannot stare at it without hurting your eyes. Together with the moon, the combination is extremely bright, bringing light to everything, so she is the light of his life.
ReplyDeleteWhat does the author mean by saying "you calm the world with your mind, not a gun"?